Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Repair, refinishing, restoration, how-to's, etc.
User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:
Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 8:22 am

Doc -

I need your professional advise here since we no longer have access to the forum with all of your information about cutting down the shelf and grip on vintage Kodiaks to alter them like Fred Bear did on his personal bows.

It's past time for me to start working on this 1960 Kodiak in preparation for the beginning of its 50th Birthday celebration which begins here in a few short days....

What size piece should I measure, mark, and I saw off the shelf ???

I'm guessing somewhere around or over the 1/4" mark on this tape...

As always thanks so much for your help...
Attachments
60 Freds 011.jpg
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

bowdoc
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1003
Joined:Fri Nov 06, 2009 11:10 am

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by bowdoc » Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:00 am

yap that would be about right 1/4" off the shelf with a saw if your comfee sawing on your bow or you can saw grind sand however you can to remove the extra stock.I use a small fine tooth hack saw normally and I always put masking tape over the area I'am going to be sawing.I did not post pics of the tape on the other thread as I kept removing the tape to take pics but the tape will keep the wood from chipping.I know you know the rules about taking your time.One more bit of food for thought ? Fred's shelf was not crowned it was actually pretty flat really as there was not much of it left.Maybe its time to post a little something on TR collecters forum about shelf removel ? I do not see myself getting back on TG for sometime to come.bd

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:28 am

Doc - As always, thanks for your input.

I'll cut down the shelf this evening as there will be lots of time to get her done then. Will post photographs when the sawdust has settled.

Yes, you should post your step by step instructions from cutting down your 1964 Kodiak or some other bow that you have done since.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

kurtbel5
5X5 Bull
Posts:204
Joined:Mon Nov 09, 2009 1:32 pm

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by kurtbel5 » Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:37 am

Doc
On the 1st cut, do you cut straight in from the handle side, or down from the site window?
Are you looking for a perfect 90 degree shelf?

Wade
Look forward to watching this happen

bowdoc
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1003
Joined:Fri Nov 06, 2009 11:10 am

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by bowdoc » Wed Dec 16, 2009 12:02 pm

hey Kurt thats a great ? I actually cut a little from one side and then the other in hopes of them matching and not under cutting the shelf or into the sight widow.I've done a couple on a band saw too but thats not for the weak hearted.Power tools can F%$# up a good bow so fast its not even funny.Best to make a shallow cut on both shelf and from the sight window.I'am thinking I better look for those pics.Hey Wade are you going to want to make her a bit more center shot also ? bd

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 12:56 pm

Doc - Actually, I was thinking of trying to finish up with the bow being less center shot. That is, moving the arrow closer to my index finger.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

kurtbel5
5X5 Bull
Posts:204
Joined:Mon Nov 09, 2009 1:32 pm

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by kurtbel5 » Wed Dec 16, 2009 1:42 pm

Why less center shot Wade?? are you changing your plate/rest set up also?
I'm not criticizing, just curious,
might think of taking a little more off one side of the handle than the other.

Thanks BD

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 3:07 pm

kurtbel5 wrote:Why less center shot Wade?? are you changing your plate/rest set up also?
I'm not criticizing, just curious,
might think of taking a little more off one side of the handle than the other.
Just thinking of moving the arrow a little left to be more over the knuckle of the left hand.

Had also thought of grinding some off the left side of the handle as you suggest.

Will probably cut down the shelf first, then shoot it a while before proceeding.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

shick
Spike Bull
Posts:30
Joined:Thu Nov 19, 2009 11:42 am

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by shick » Wed Dec 16, 2009 3:53 pm

Hey guys, not being concerned with multiple spined arrows from a true center shot bow, maybe Wade has something there about closer to his index finger. Determine the spine and perhaps a little easier acquiring the target??
Shick

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:19 pm

This is the victim that we will be operating on. Already spent several hours grinding and filing out the tennis ball grip and turning it into a slightly thicker than normal 1959 grip.

Rosewood is really light and not much grain. Put some wipe on poly on the ground off grip area to get an idea of what this slab would look like if it were refinished with this poly...

Factory coin is an odd duck for a 1960 Kodiak. I've had two original 60 Kodiaks with this type coin.
Attachments
2.jpg
Last edited by Wade Phillips on Wed Dec 16, 2009 10:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:24 pm

The shelf we will cut down...

As you can see the finish on this bow is shot...
Attachments
3.jpg
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:36 pm

Comparing the preliminary line to a Signature bow to confirm the line will be in the ball park...
Attachments
5.jpg
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:37 pm

Final line is drawn...

We are Locked and Loaded...
Attachments
6.jpg
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:39 pm

A new 32 teeth per inch hack saw blade about 2/3 of the way in on the side cut...
Attachments
7.jpg
Last edited by Wade Phillips on Wed Dec 16, 2009 10:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:41 pm

Mini hack saw 52 teeth per inch for the sight window cut...
Attachments
8.jpg
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:45 pm

For the last 1/4 distance, cut slowly alternating between the two cuts until the shelf fell off...
Attachments
9.jpg
Last edited by Wade Phillips on Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 9:50 pm

Easy part is over.

Work begins when final shaping the shelf and handle... but we'll tackle that tomorrow...
Attachments
9-1.jpg
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Wed Dec 16, 2009 10:08 pm

Doc - Let me know what I've screwed up so far, and if this bow can be salvaged or not. And if it would be best that it just be thrown it in the trash can now before any more time is wasted on it.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

bowdoc
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1003
Joined:Fri Nov 06, 2009 11:10 am

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by bowdoc » Thu Dec 17, 2009 6:41 am

yap I'd scrap it now before you get any more work into it.Fact is its your lucky day I have to make a dump run next week to scrap out a bunch of bows I screwed up.You may as well send me that one and I'll save you the dump fee.
OK really it looks super good very nice job and well done the hack saw saves hours of grinding and or sanding to remove the shelf.Hey you looking for a little extra work on the side ? I think I'll start sending guy's your way.bd

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Thu Dec 17, 2009 9:30 am

Doc - I'm not looking for any work.

Hey, I'm retired.

I could probably spend the next 10 years just restoring and fixing up the several hundred bows right here under my nose that are in need of some type of repairs from grips and strike plates to complete refinishing.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

bowdoc
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1003
Joined:Fri Nov 06, 2009 11:10 am

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by bowdoc » Thu Dec 17, 2009 10:10 am

you must have not gotten my new business card as yet huh ? Have spray gun will travel wire bowdoc Seattle.bd

kurtbel5
5X5 Bull
Posts:204
Joined:Mon Nov 09, 2009 1:32 pm

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by kurtbel5 » Thu Dec 17, 2009 10:27 am

Come on Wade this can't be your 1st time at the rodeo !!
Very nice job so far

droptine59
Raghorn Bull
Posts:48
Joined:Thu Sep 03, 2009 5:33 pm
Location:maryland
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by droptine59 » Thu Dec 17, 2009 11:40 am

Very nice cut Wade. Looking good!!!!

User avatar
bowhunterfrompast
5X5 Bull
Posts:486
Joined:Fri Feb 06, 2009 11:16 pm
Location:Missouri

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by bowhunterfrompast » Thu Dec 17, 2009 1:12 pm

Wade...just wondering, is the flat shelf a better design over a radius? Or is the flat more in line with the Bears?
Rick
Broadhead Collector
Have a great hunt!

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Thu Dec 17, 2009 1:32 pm

Rick - Frankly, I have no real idea what in the hell I'm doing. I'm sure you will come to realize that as you see this project progress.

Kurt - I've never cut the shelf down on any bow before. Doc's 101 class somehow gave me the illusion that I could do about anything to a bow... That's the only reason I'm doing this myself, rather than sending it to him...

Just finished up about 4 more hours this morning working on the bow.

Scrapped off the finish on the sight window and filed off the ledge on the inside corner of the shelf...
Attachments
a.jpg
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Thu Dec 17, 2009 1:38 pm

Cut a little off the handle to fit my hand a bit better, and reduced the outside of the shelf some.

At this point, I decided to radius the shelf a bit....
Attachments
a (1).jpg
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Thu Dec 17, 2009 1:45 pm

Got the shelf slightly radiused.

Changed the shape of the riser overlays to suite my taste. They were flat, wide and ugly. I like them narrow, pointed and raised (we are still talking about the overlays).
Attachments
a (2).jpg
a (3).jpg
Last edited by Wade Phillips on Thu Dec 17, 2009 1:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

User avatar
Wade Phillips
Royal (6X6) Bull
Posts:1069
Joined:Thu Nov 05, 2009 1:10 pm
Location:Nebraska
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Wade Phillips » Thu Dec 17, 2009 1:49 pm

Sanded the riser a bit...

Probably need to take some more off the handle and reshape the belly side of the grip area.

May need to reduce the size of the shelf. May take it down a little more... Still a lot larger then Fred's 1959 Kodiak.

Finished for the day, but will shoot it this afternoon.
Attachments
a (4).jpg
a (5).jpg
"Real Sportsmanship is Fair Play" - Art Young

droptine59
Raghorn Bull
Posts:48
Joined:Thu Sep 03, 2009 5:33 pm
Location:maryland
Contact:

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by droptine59 » Thu Dec 17, 2009 3:02 pm

I am running home now to break out my saw.. I am inspired Wade!

User avatar
Stickbow98
4X4 Bull
Posts:79
Joined:Sat Dec 12, 2009 1:09 am

Re: Altering a 1960 Kodiak to be Like Fred Bear's Bows

Post by Stickbow98 » Thu Dec 17, 2009 5:43 pm

Really nice work, Wade. Almost like watching Fred himself set up one of his bows. (Now THAT would have been a classic pic how-to!)

(Who knew that Wade Phillips, mild-mannered Author, Collector, and Curator of Vintage Archery History, had it in him to take a HACKSAW to one of his beloved 1960 Kodiaks??) :shock: :twisted:

Post Reply